VANDERBURGH COUNTY COUNCIL 2019 BUDGET HEARING MEETING MINUTES AUGUST 1, 2018

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1 2019 BUDGET HEARING MEETING MINUTES The Vanderburgh County Council met for the 2019 budget hearings this 1 st day of August, 2018 in room 301 of the Civic Center Complex. Vanderburgh County Council President John Montrastelle called the meeting to order at 10:08 a.m. President Montrastelle: We re going to start the Vanderburgh County Council 2019 budget hearings dated August the 1 st. Let s do a roll call, please. COUNCILMEMBER PRESENT ABSENT Councilmember Terry Councilmember Kiefer Councilmember Shetler Councilmember Goebel Councilmember Raben X X X X X Councilmember Koehler Lindsey X President Montrastelle X President Montrastelle: We have a quorum. COUNCIL PRESIDENT OPENING REMARKS President Montrastelle: So, welcome to our budget hearings. Today we ve got quite a few departments that we re going to have come up one at a time to explain their budgets and what they want to do, and any other issues or concerns, or pains or success stories that they want to share, you re welcome to it. We ll run to, well, until we re done, but maybe till 12:00, and then, of course, we ll pick up tomorrow with the balance of our departments, we ll pick up tomorrow, run from 9:00 to 12:00 again tomorrow. The, what s been submitted, pretty much, most departments have come in flat, and we thank you for that. I think we have a really quality group of individuals that head up our departments, and I m thankful for that. I think the voters of Vanderburgh County should be thankful for each and every one of you. Trust and know that we re going to do everything we can to live within our budget, and we re working towards perhaps extending another pay raise to our county employees, but we don t know yet. But, that s something we re all hopeful, and we re going to work towards doing. But, also, by living within our budget, but, and also by providing good services that the Vanderburgh County residents deserve. So, with that, I ll turn it over to our Auditor, Brian Gerth, for any opening comments he might want to have. COUNTY AUDITOR OPENING REMARKS Brian Gerth: Thank you, John. I just kind of want to bring the Council up to date with, the DLGF, they ve changed their budget cycle. A lot of timelines and deadlines have changed, and a lot of the estimates that they provide our office come within the last few days, and we really don t have enough time to digest all of that. We re still working on our net assessed value, and that plays into the budget process, it plays into the circuit breaker estimates. It all plays into advertising so we can have this meeting, and I really would like for the Council to think about, next year, moving the budget hearings back a couple of

2 Page 2 of 40 BUDGET HEARING weeks, so we can, so I can give you guys better information, up front, and let us go through our revenue projections, so I can give you good information. You know, like I said last week, you know, I feel like our budget requests are inflated, because there s a lot of duplicate requests, which we ll work through all that. You know, even with the duplicates, we re going to need to look at probably some initial cuts to get to our numbers, but, again, not all of the information is in yet, so we ll just kind of see how that goes. But, just, in comparison to last year, or this year we have $124 million in requests, last year we had $94 million. You know, so, in the General Fund there s $71 million in requests, and we, I think last year it was like $52 million, and we adopted just under 51. We probably need to be in that range again, but, you know, once we put everything together, we ll work through the process. You know, Council s going to have to make some decisions on some lines, you know, the Public Defender, and items like that. Councilmember Shetler: Brian, is that a product maybe of confusion over a new local ordinance that s changing, trying to change a little bit of how we operated in the past? Brian Gerth: Well, there was one issue with that, yes, but, you know, the circuit breaker estimates that come from the State were due to us yesterday, and there s no way I can, you know, we had to advertise this meeting two weeks ago. The local ordinance was an issue, yes President Montrastelle: Right. Brian Gerth: -- for the 2018 process. President Montrastelle: And there were a lot of duplicates, as well, that drove that requested $124 million, you know. Brian Gerth: Uh-huh. Councilmember Shetler: Which I think is a result of confusion (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) President Montrastelle: Correct. Yes, does any other Councilmembers want to make ten seconds before we move into it? James? Councilmember Raben: No. President Montrastelle: Okay. Councilmember Raben: No comments, ready to go. President Montrastelle: Okay, alright. That was a comment in itself. DEPARTMENT BUDGETS CO-OP EXTENSION SERVICE President Montrastelle: Alright, first up is our Co-Op Extension. We can turn to page 20. Naturally, when everyone comes up to the podium, please state your name and who your with, and that good stuff. Meagan Brothers: Good morning, Meagan Brothers, County Extension Director for Purdue Extension Vanderburgh County. President Montrastelle: Is there anything that you want to say about your budget, which is on page 20? Meagan Brothers: Well, I had, we had a two and half percent increase in Contractual Services, which comes from Purdue. But, I was able to shave off some money in other line items to be able to make our total budget close to flat. Councilmember Raben: What, what is planned for the additional Travel & Mileage?

3 BUDGET HEARING Page 3 of 40 Meagan Brothers: Oh, yes, so, kind of a success story, I guess. So, Purdue is able, was able to provide us with an additional Educator. They are grant funding it for this year. She is focusing in the Promise Zone Area, and I didn t think this would be the greatest meeting to introduce her to you guys. So, I ll be bringing her to another meeting to introduce you, but we re able to provide some extra programming, which then means some additional travel. So, I had to increase our travel just a little bit to accommodate for that. President Montrastelle: Okay. Any questions of Meagan? No? That s it. Meagan Brothers: Awesome, thank you. President Montrastelle: Thank you, Meagan, appreciate it. CO-OP EXTENSION SERVICE COIT President Montrastelle: Are you also, Co-Op Extension Service Meagan Brothers: Yes. President Montrastelle: COIT? Yes? Meagan Brothers: Yes. President Montrastelle: Page 104. Brian Gerth: I think that s just her Rent. Meagan Brothers: I was going to say, I think that s just the Rent, which is flat for this year. There s no change in that. President Montrastelle: Okay. Meagan Brothers: Awesome, thank you. President Montrastelle: Very good. Thank you. TREASURER/TREASURER ELECTED OFFICIALS TRAINING & TREASURER COIT President Montrastelle: Next is Treasurer on page four. Susan Kirk: Susan Kirk, Vanderburgh County Treasurer. President Montrastelle: Hi, Susan. Susan Kirk: Hi. President Montrastelle: What s up? Councilmember Raben: Susie, there s an increase Susan Kirk: Well, I submitted my budget, which is Councilmember Raben: --the Contractual Susan Kirk: --about like it was last year, and, uh Councilmember Raben: What is the increase in Contractual? Susan Kirk: There was a question, Mike, do you want to address that? About the travel? Councilmember Goebel: Travel? Susan Kirk: There was a discussion about Travel, and the Commissioners we had a meeting over here, and that they were going to switch something around to where we could take, like my Chief Deputy goes, and she can come out of the Travel budget, mine, that $2,000. And, so, that s it, so. Instead of going to the Commissioners, it would just come out of ours. So, I put an extra thousand in there, just in case, but we, I doubt we d use it. If you don t want to give it to us, I m okay with that too.

4 Page 4 of 40 President Montrastelle: Okay. BUDGET HEARING Councilmember Raben: (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) would have been more appropriate in the Training budget anyway, probably. Susan Kirk: That s what most of this is, is that. Councilmember Raben: Yeah. Susan Kirk: I do have one of my employees that s on the board of, of course, we re switching subjects there, but anyway, whatever you decide is fine, we ll work it out. President Montrastelle: Is there a line item for Training? Councilmember Raben: Yeah. President Montrastelle: Where is that, where is that at? Susan Kirk: It s $2,000. Councilmember Raben: It s on page 86. President Montrastelle: Oh, okay. Susan Kirk: But, that s only for me, and I only go to one President Montrastelle: Yeah. Susan Kirk: --meeting, to get my 15 hours in, and I take one person with me, my Chief Deputy. I don t go to any of those other meetings, none. It s the only thing I do. Councilmember Raben: No, that s what I ve said, though, that the Travel & Mileage probably would be better fit in that Training budget. Susan Kirk: Yeah, sure. Brian Gerth: I can jump in on that. The Elected Officials Training Fund can only be spent on Susie going to the Treasurer s Conference or an AIC Conference. It can t be spent on her Chief Deputy or anybody else doing any travel. Susan Kirk: That s what the other $1,000 is in there for, but you re going to get that money back, because I don t use that $2,000. Brian Gerth: Yeah. Susan Kirk: So, you re going to get it back. You re going to break, more than even, at the end. Brian Gerth: And, something that was said in that other meeting with the Commissioners, just so the Council knows, the Auditor s Association is trying to go back to, through legislation for their Elected Officials Training Fund to maybe open up the spending, what that money can be spent on. Because in our, for our county, we budget roughly $10,000, but we don t spend $10,000 a year, and we re bringing in probably close to $25,000 every year. So, we ve got a surplus, it s jut we re limited on what we can spend that money on. So, like, even my budget, I can t spend, I can t take my Chief Deputy to the Auditor s Conference and pay for it out of that fund. I have to find other means. President Montrastelle: Okay, and on page 86, we just touched on that, Elected Officials Training. You re in it flat, $2,000 for your travel that s required of you to do that. Susan Kirk: It is, and I don t even come close to using that. President Montrastelle: And, you don t what? Susan Kirk: I don t even come close to using that amount of money. You get it back. President Montrastelle: Okay. Then on page 102, Bank Service Charge of $5,000. Susan Kirk: Yes, from $55,000 down to $5,000.

5 BUDGET HEARING Page 5 of 40 President Montrastelle: Okay. Councilmember Kiefer: Question? President Montrastelle: Yes? Councilmember Kiefer: So, how did you do that? I mean, just told them you didn t want to pay bank fees and they cooperated? Susan Kirk: I have my ways. Councilmember Kiefer: Well, that s good work. I think that s awesome. Susan Kirk: When my dad was Treasurer, the bank gave the county money for us, you know, to give them money. They would give us money back. I take office and it s totally different. So, anyway, I have an that they don t ever want me to read in front of you all. So, we re good. Councilmember Kiefer: I ve got one question for you, and this is just because you re here, not part of this, necessarily the budget, but, all the time we get these reports from the Vanderburgh County Treasurer, and they re sent to the Visitors and Convention Bureau and they always show the people who are delinquent in paying their Innskeeper Tax. Do any of these tax bills, do these eventually get collected? Or, I mean, I ve seen these year after year after year, I see these unpaid. Do they sometimes just completely go unpaid? Or is there a mechanism to collect these eventually? Susan Kirk: All we can do is, by State law there is obviously time limits to where you pay that, if you don t, you start incurring penalties, and if you don t, then you can possibly lose whatever, you know. There s not a whole lot that we can do Councilmember Kiefer: But, you place liens, the county places liens on the property? Susan Kirk: Yes, they could do that, yes. Uh-huh. Councilmember Kiefer: Okay. Councilmember Shetler: Along those lines, Susie, real quick, a lot of these motels, particularly along North Fares, I would call them almost apartment dwellings, they re more permanent residences. So, what becomes the qualification on an Innkeepers Tax versus a more permanent type of dwelling that someone s renting. Susan Kirk: I m not too sure about that, but I will find out and I will send you all an addressing that, but right off hand, I don t want to say something wrong. Councilmember Shetler: Right. Susan Kirk: So, let me check into that. Councilmember Shetler: Alright, thank you. Councilmember Kiefer: One last question, and I know we ve got a lot on the schedule, so, what s the likelihood, or how much money do we lose because we don t collect this Innkeepers Tax? I mean, what s the total dollar annually that maybe we lose? You know, sometimes there s these groups out there, I know that we pay some people, and say, hey, if you can collect this money you get to keep half of it, or a portion of it, or something. I mean, is there any company out there that we can hire to chase after these deadbeat taxpayers? Susan Kirk: I have actually looked into that, because I did that in the Clerk s Office, and did collect quite a bit of money. I m going to the conference next week, and I m going to look into that a little bit more Councilmember Kiefer: Thank you. Susan Kirk: --because there will be some vendors up there, because, yeah, I ve thought about that for the last couple of years, because we collected quite a bit of money in the Clerk s Office from

6 Page 6 of 40 Councilmember Kiefer: Okay. Well, great, that s good. BUDGET HEARING Susan Kirk: --that didn t cost us a penny. They just would give us a check. Councilmember Kiefer: Well, if you don t mind, report back to us on that. Susan Kirk: Will do. Councilmember Goebel: So, you re going to spend your thousand dollars next week, huh? I m kidding. Susan Kirk: Probably about what, I don t know, $500. Councilmember Goebel: I m kidding. I do have a question about the travel expense that, not for Susie, but for everyone in general. Have they been entered, maybe Brian could help me. President Montrastelle: Sorry, what were you asking? Councilmember Goebel: We have line items now for Travel for each budget, and they also, some have, other funds that they could use, is that correct? Or is that not correct? Brian Gerth: Yeah, some departments do have additional funds that they could spend for travel. Like my department, I have the Ineligible Homestead Fund, that s where I pay for additional travel and training. Councilmember Goebel: So, and you have not entered anything additional in your line items? Brian Gerth: No, but I ve always Councilmember Goebel: In the General Fund? Brian Gerth: -- had a budget. I ve always, even the Auditor before me had a travel budget in our Ineligible Homestead. So, it s really no change for us. The Treasurer doesn t have an additional fund that they can pull from. They just Councilmember Goebel: Okay, so the department s that don t have an additional funding mechanism, will be asking for a travel allowance? Brian Gerth: Yes. Councilmember Goebel: Okay, that s I wanted to know. Thanks. President Montrastelle: Susie, when I was at the Association of State of County of Councils of Indiana, there was a program that was presented to us, I think it was called TRECS, it s a way to, you know, collect some overdue money. I know I forwarded that to you, it s something you were looking into? Susan Kirk: Yeah, Brian and I have been looking into some of this, so President Montrastelle: I know it s new, it s a new program, and they, up there at Shelbyville they were saying that it s kind of a test, and when it fills up with people, the counties that want to do it, it s going to be closed until they evaluate it. But, there seems to be some success with some counties collecting overdue money, you know. So, I know you re looking at it. Susan Kirk: Yeah, I ll know more when I get back from the seminar that I m going to next week, and I ll actually have some paperwork President Montrastelle: Right. Susan Kirk: --to where I can give you guys, and you can kind of look at it too, so that we all are in agreement. President Montrastelle: Okay. Thank you, Susie. Susan Kirk: Thank you.

7 BUDGET HEARING Page 7 of 40 CORONER President Montrastelle: Next up is our Coroner, and we can turn to page 12. Steve Lockyear: Good morning, Steve Lockyear, Vanderburgh County Coroner. President Montrastelle: Hi, Steve. Steve Lockyear: I will address, if you want to go, there s some equipment request, quite a bit of money there, about $87,000. If you ll notice that, under Capital Outlay. I believe that might have been resolved. That s for the building itself, and it is owned by the Commissioners. That s for a new heating and air conditioning unit, and the generator has to be upgraded in there. It s a 30 year old standby generator, and it needs to be upgraded. There s no longer any parts available for it, especially in the circuit panels. As we all know, it will fail when we need it. So, I think that s going over towards the Commissioners side. That probably can be pulled out of there. President Montrastelle: Okay. Steve Lockyear: We might put an asterisk next to those, but I believe, and we may even be able to resolve the heating and air conditioning on this year s budget, and might not even have to affect next year s budget. Brian Gerth: If I could ask a question, because I noticed that. Steve Lockyear: Yeah. Brian Gerth: I will, for Council s sake, the Commissioners have agreed to, they ve got a $50,000 line in the Riverboat Fund for this request. I think my question was, because this was $87,000 versus the $50,000, I mean, is $50,000 enough? Or do you need the Steve Lockyear: Well, we got just a, for the generator we got just kind of a, not necessarily an itemized bid, but just kind of a guesstimate on how much it would be, because, you know, when they get into it, the current one, is installed inside the building. It s not under fire code, we had it looked at, it s supposed to be in a two hour burn room, it s just sitting out in the garage. So, it will have to be moved outside, would be the cheapest way of doing that. And, uh, so, you know, we ve got a guesstimate of what it would cost, but it could be less, it could be more. President Montrastelle: Yeah, it s an old generator. Steve Lockyear: It s an old generator. President Montrastelle: Yeah. Steve Lockyear: It s the second oldest that the company services. The other one is in Huntingburg, Indiana at the Armory. President Montrastelle: It takes up a lot of room too in there. Steve Lockyear: Oh, yeah. It s a big V8 Ford engine. President Montrastelle: Yeah. Steve Lockyear: Sitting in the garage. President Montrastelle: Yeah. Okay, Mike? Councilmember Goebel: Steve, you, obviously, have been very busy. Anyone who pays attention to the news at all. Sorry about that, but it s the way it is. You asked for four additional autopsy carts, or just one? Steve Lockyear: Right, those carts, the ones we have now are original carts. We run out of room on a regular basis of where to put people. We re at 21 homicides already this year. We had 28 last year. We re already at 21 this year, you know, and just so you know, we started a program with, the State is paying for a vast majority of our toxicology testing. Probably will save us, maybe $30,000 hopefully, this year, as a grant through them. So, that should help us a little bit on that Autopsy Fund. Now, we ll probably, as you all know,

8 Page 8 of 40 BUDGET HEARING kind of every September-October we come back and kind of finish out the year, based on what we think we ll need, and we ll probably do the same this year. But, we can save a little bit of money on toxicology testing costs, the State s covering that cost now. President Montrastelle: Okay. Councilmember Goebel: I was just wondering if you could get by with less than four. Steve Lockyear: Actually, I probably need six or eight, and I cut it down to four. Councilmember Goebel: Scratch that question. Steve Lockyear: Yeah, I mean, these cots are original cots. We re using old tables now that aren t even, without getting too graphic, biohazard containment. So, we re actually just using old tables sometimes. President Montrastelle: Yeah. Okay, alright, thank you, Steve, appreciate it. Steve Lockyear: Thank you, guys. President Montrastelle: Good job. WEIGHTS & MEASURES President Montrastelle: Weights & Measures next, on page 25. Jacob Murphy: Jacob Murphy, Vanderburgh County Weights & Measures. President Montrastelle: Hi, Jacob. Jacob Murphy: Hey. President Montrastelle: Is there anything you want to point out? Jacob Murphy: No, I mean, no increase. Everything s pretty thin, but we re working with it. President Montrastelle: How s the new job coming along? Jacob Murphy: It s great. President Montrastelle: You re liking it? Jacob Murphy: Learning a lot, yeah. President Montrastelle: Yeah? Good. Any questions from the Council? Alright, thank you, sir. Jacob Murphy: Okay, thank you. SURVEYOR President Montrastelle: Next up is our Surveyor. We ll start on page 11. Jeff Mueller: Good morning. Jeff Mueller, County Surveyor. I know you guys get inundated with paper, and you re sitting there trying to shuffle through it. So, I got a couple of little handouts for you. First of all we re talking General Fund dollars. For 2019, I m showing a reduction of about $50,000. That s a result of two things; (1) is an employee that s going to be retiring, and I won t be replacing him, and the other is, we are going to move an employee s wage from the General Fund to the Corner Perpetuation Fund. If it wasn t for the retiring employee s payout, which we got $15,620.19, the actual reduction would be more like $66,000. So, I don t think you ll have too much problem with that. Just so you, that after the retirement, there s myself, the Chief Deputy and five other full time positions, and then there s a part time position. So, in 2018, and we ll get to talking about this in a minute in the Corner Perpetuation Fund, four and a third positions are being

9 BUDGET HEARING Page 9 of 40 funded out of the General Fund, and the other two and two thirds positions are coming out of the Corner Perpetuation Fund. So, trying to shift that money more over. Now, I would love to tell you that that s all because I ve done wonderful things, but what s happened is that the State changed the fee structure in our Corner Perpetuation Fund is generating much more income than we used to be. So, you re getting the benefit of that, okay? President Montrastelle: Okay. Jeff Mueller: Any questions on that? President Montrastelle: No. Councilmember Raben: Good job. President Montrastelle: Yes, very good job, Jeff. SURVEYOR S MAP FUND & SURVEYOR S ELECTED OFFICIALS TRAINING President Montrastelle: Then, on page 64, he s got Surveyor s Map at $500, which is flat. Then on page 88, again, Jeff, is flat, at $2,000 requested for Training, Travel, for yourself. Jeff Mueller: Elected Officials Fund, it s been that President Montrastelle: Yep. Jeff Mueller: --way every year. I do use that money. President Montrastelle: Yep. Jeff Mueller: Purdue, I hate to say that word, Purdue Road School, that s pretty much mandatory, it s a very good meeting for County Surveyors. I also go to an IDEM Conference, and also go to, sometimes, Farm Bureau Drainage. This year, actually I ll be going to a flood conference here in Evansville, so we won t have any travel expense, only just their fees. But, the Indiana Flood Association is having a three day meeting here in September. I m going to be using your new hotel and the conference center, so getting a little benefit of that. SURVEYOR S CORNER PERPETUATION FUND President Montrastelle: And, I skipped one on page 82, which is your Perpetuation Fund. Jeff Mueller: Yeah, let s, I mean, if you don t mind, I would like to spend just a few minutes talking about that. I sent you a diagram there, so, if you would look, you ll see that the blue, or the first column is what came and I m sorry, first of all let me start at the red column is what was spent every year. Okay? Then you ll see the blue is, of the amount of the red column, how much was in salaries. So, essentially, for, through 2016 we spent about $27,000 in salaries, which funded, essentially, half of one position and one part time position. Then, the third column, the green is the income. So, in 2017, the charge, there was a change in the Recorders fees. We used to get five dollars per every deed recorded, now we get five dollars for everything recorded. So, what happened is, between 2011 and 2016 the average income to that fund was $37,000. Now we re seeing that increase by about three and a half to four times on a monthly basis. That jives with what we heard when this was being proposed. A lot of the County Surveyors had talked to their Auditors, and I talked to ours, and everybody said, you re going to see income increase by three to five times. So, with that, last year I saw that coming and I moved one position to the, from the General Fund to the Corner Perpetuation. Now, I ve moved another position there, and a little bit of extra money. So, like I say, now, instead of a half a position coming out of the Corner Perpetuation Fund, about two and two thirds people are coming out of the Corner Perpetuation Fund. Now, one other thing I would like to show you on that, is if you ll look, you ll see that I am asking for more than just normal money, and that is, there is a one time expenditure of $35,000 for new survey equipment. Our survey equipment was bought in I m going to use the old analogy that pictures are worth a thousand words. I ve got two pictures on here that are worth 2,000 words. If you look on the left, everything on that table is what we need now. And, on the right, that nice little box, is what we re proposing to go to. To use a little story from Radio Shack, they had a

10 Page 10 of 40 BUDGET HEARING Director of Radio Shack one time said, you know, the problem with Radio Shack is everything we sell in our store is now on my cell phone. Kind of similar. We need some new surveying equipment. Ours is going to go out on us, and it s extremely outdated. Again, this money would come out of the Corner Perpetuation Fund, just like we buy our computers out of the Corner Perpetuation Fund, we pay for all of our licenses out of the Corner Perpetuation Fund, we bought a new scanner and plotter, new Xerox machine, all of that stuff comes out of the Corner Perpetuation Fund. President Montrastelle: Is the used equipment worth anything? Jeff Mueller: Very little. It s like President Montrastelle: How long Jeff Mueller: --you know, it s like a flip phone. President Montrastelle: How long will this new equipment last? Jeff Mueller: Well, John, I mean, the last has lasted for 18 years. It s going to be more a matter of the technology, how long will it be before it s outdated, but, you know, it will be around for awhile. President Montrastelle: Are there updates within this new system where you download new, whatever is current? Jeff Mueller: Some of the stuff that this stuff is coming out is unbelievable, and I don t even know what we re going to buy yet. The Water & Sewer Department bought what s called, a system called Navien, and we are going to have a salesman come up next week and show us that equipment. But, everybody s just, it s just amazing what this stuff will do anymore, and how much of it can, you know, what all it will do, in the field even with it. Our systems are so old right now, when we download it on the computer we ve got an old Windows, I don t know what it is, Windows XP, we can t even be online with it anymore, the computer, but, you know, our software is so old and a lot of our own equipment it won t even run on our computers now. President Montrastelle: Okay. Councilmember Shetler: Jeff, what s the balance of that fund? Jeff Mueller: Right now, it used, Tom, it would normally run around $40,000, and as of the first of this month, it s $133,000. Councilmember Shetler: Cash in hand? Jeff Mueller: Cash in hand. Councilmember Shetler: Okay. Jeff Mueller: And, that s why, yeah, you see, I m just spending more than what I m bringing in, but I ve got a lot better balance that I ve ever had in that fund. Councilmember Shetler: Well, let me just say that, you know, I appreciate your coming forward and full disclosure on everything. We haven t always had that on perpetuation, whatever the word is. Jeff Mueller: I understand. Councilmember Shetler: In the past, so I appreciate that, and, I mean, I think, you know, given that, you know, it s something we ought to consider real hard, because, obviously, it s something that s going to help, probably, you know, technology has a way of really saving a lot on costs of what it would be to, you know, keep things more efficient and stuff. Jeff Mueller: And it s going to allow us to do things in the field that we can t do right now. Councilmember Shetler: Right.

11 BUDGET HEARING Page 11 of 40 Jeff Mueller: Even, and, no, and I appreciate that. As you know, I came from industry and I have a little bit different attitude is that, the money is all the county s in the end. I don t care which door it comes through, it s your guys money in the end. So, but, I guess that s a different philosophy than some people have had. Councilmember Kiefer: Jeff, I know you re title is somewhat of a misnomer, so to speak, I mean, County Surveyor, I mean, you do all kinds of things, including drainage, and that s a big one. But, how much actual surveying do you guys physically do? Jeff Mueller: We do the corner perpetuation every day. We ve got, I ve got one to two guys out doing corner perpetuation every day. I know people are wondering, what are you doing? The corners that are out there, that were set in 1805 and 1806 are the basis for the entire survey of the county. So, every time somebody comes in with a new subdivision, they re going back to those corners to say this is our starting point. So, if those corners aren t there, and they get knocked out on a regular basis, or believe it or not, a lot of the corners are located in streets. So, every time we repave a street, we ve got to, the corners have to be reset. Councilmember Kiefer: How many of those are there? Jeff Mueller: How many corners are there? Councilmember Kiefer: Yeah. Jeff Mueller: I think it s over 2,000. Councilmember Kiefer: Wow! Okay. Jeff Mueller: Yeah, so, yes, we have someone doing corner perpetuation every day. Some people, some counties contract that out. Most counties, bigger, like ourselves and everyone else, they do it in house, because it s cheaper. Councilmember Kiefer: Okay, thanks. Jeff Mueller: So, okay, but, yeah, but you re right, Joe, we do, drainage is more our function than surveying, but, yes, we do.and we are required by State law to perpetuate the corners. Councilmember Kiefer: Okay. President Montrastelle: Jeff, well done. Jeff Mueller: Okay. President Montrastelle: Thanks. Jeff Mueller: Thank you all for your time. Good luck. President Montrastelle: Thank you so much. Jeff Mueller: Okay. COUNTY CLERK/COUNTY CLERK IV-D & CLERK ELECTED OFFICIALS TRAINING President Montrastelle: Okay, next up is our County Clerk on page one. Carla Hayden: Carla Hayden, County Clerk. President Montrastelle: Council, any questions? Councilmember Raben: No, it looks pretty flat. The Travel & Mileage, that s what we talked about with Susie. So, we ll address that in the final budget hearing. President Montrastelle: Okay, then on page 40. Supplies really, really went down. Carla Hayden: What is your page 40?

12 Page 12 of 40 Brian Gerth: It s the IV-D Fund. BUDGET HEARING Carla Hayden: Okay. President Montrastelle: IV-D Fund, sorry. Carla Hayden: Right, talking about funds that are available to us. The way it was done in the past with the IV-D, we would spend, we would spend out of the General Fund and get reimbursed into the IV-D Fund, and when I changed vendors for doing our claims, he suggested to me that some other counties would pay percentages out of the IV-D that were available, and that way you don t have to pay as much out of your General Fund, up front. If that makes any sense to everybody. Whether we re being reimbursed for what we spend out of the General Fund on some things, we can spend it directly from the IV- D and cut our expenses that way. Councilmember Raben: Yeah, in this case, though, Carla, we re actually spending less. So, we re spending more in the General Fund. It looks like you made up a little bit of the reduction in General Fund. So, are you sure you re explaining that correct? Carla Hayden: I think I am. If you re on the regular County Clerk, it had to go up a little bit because of postage, that I can t justify that, but if you re talking about the IV-D. Councilmember Raben: She reduced the Perpetuation Fund, she s reduced the fund. She s reduced the IV-D. Oh, that s the (Inaudible) President Montrastelle: What are you saying, Brian? Councilmember Raben: --portion of the IV-D. Carla Hayden: Yeah. Brian Gerth: I m sorry. Councilmember Raben: I gotcha, it s the General Fund portion of the IV-D. Brian Gerth: This is the General Fund that we re looking at. Carla Hayden: That s the General Fund portion. It s less because I m spending more out of the IV-D Fund. Councilmember Kiefer: So, you re still spending the same amount of money? Carla Hayden: I m still spending money, it s just Councilmember Kiefer: Shifted. Carla Hayden: --shifting it a little bit to where I can. Councilmember Raben: I gotcha. Councilmember Kiefer: (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) Carla Hayden: Record Storage is also comes out of, well, it comes out of the Clerk s Perpetuation Fund, is where the Record Storage comes from, and we ve also been able to reduce that. It doesn t affect you guys much, but what comes out of our Perpetuation Fund we ve been able to reduce it by some, by bringing some records back on-site, since we expanded the amount of storage we can use in the basement, and also by going through and paying more attention to the retention schedules and things that have, you know, past their retention date, we re getting rid of, because we don t have to keep them anymore. So, storing less off-site. President Montrastelle: Okay. Then we ve got on page 84, your Elected Training Fund, travel fund, which is flat, $2,400. Any questions from the Council? Councilmember Kiefer: Just a quick comment. President Montrastelle: Joe?

13 BUDGET HEARING Page 13 of 40 Councilmember Kiefer: I mean, I was just curious, so we can never purge files, you know, that are years old. Carla Hayden: There s some that we keep forever. We have records in the basement right now, books that go back to when Vanderburgh County was created, and we have to keep those forever. Councilmember Kiefer: I mean, I understand those historic documents. Carla Hayden: Right. Councilmember Kiefer: But, I m saying, you know Carla Hayden: Not everything has (Inaudible. Speaking over each other.) Councilmember Kiefer: --people that are dead Carla Hayden: --some things just have a really long time, have a really long retention schedule, and then some things are forever. Then some things are 10 years, you know, so. Councilmember Kiefer: So, do we purge? Carla Hayden: We do purge. Councilmember Kiefer: Okay. Carla Hayden: And, that s some of the things I was talking about we were doing, that things had been taken off site and nobody paid any attention that, oh, this has already met its retention schedule, we can get rid of this. Councilmember Kiefer: Okay. Carla Hayden: So, we re doing some of that too. Councilmember Kiefer: Okay, thanks. President Montrastelle: Thank you. Thank you, Carla. Carla Hayden: Thank you. President Montrastelle: Good job. ELECTION OFFICE President Montrastelle: I m sorry? I did, we hit on the Election Office, did we? Councilmember Raben: (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) President Montrastelle: Yeah, we did. Didn t I? I didn t? Carla Hayden: We can talk election. President Montrastelle: Okay, sorry, page 17. Carla Hayden: And, those numbers are going to be down because it s a city election next year. President Montrastelle: Yep. Carla Hayden: And, those are just my best guess, based on what we did four years ago. President Montrastelle: Any questions? Councilmember Raben: Is this the entire amount? Or, is this Carla Hayden: Yeah, I went ahead and did the entire amount. It s my understanding that, historically, maybe that those had been cut to a half, and then done, but I went ahead and did, I did a full year budget.

14 Page 14 of 40 BUDGET HEARING Councilmember Raben: That s why I was asking, is this the full amount? So, we can cut it in half. Well, because we ll bill them in advance. Carla Hayden: Right, I understand that s what s been done historically, but I went ahead and did a full year budget. President Montrastelle: Okay, thank you. SHERIFF S OFFICE President Montrastelle: Okay, I can ask you to turn to page 6, the Sheriff s Department. My favorite out of all of it. The Sheriff is asking for a 2.26 percent increase. Do you want to point out anything, Sheriff? Dave Wedding: Ever item that we ask for additional funding, probably won t adequately cover what we need, but it s necessities, like for Training & Education, when we were trying to train our jail staff with a $5,000 annual training budget, which didn t even get us close to about three months worth of training. We just asked for $10,000, which still won t cover it, but we ll make up the difference with some perpetuation accounts. Our Canine accounts President Montrastelle: Where, which line item is that, Sheriff? Because I see Training. Dave Wedding: Training & Education, under the Jail, President Montrastelle: Oh, 13 Councilmember Raben: You re in the jail. Councilmember Terry: It s in the jail. Dave Wedding: In the jail. President Montrastelle: You re in jail. Dave Wedding: In the jail, right. President Montrastelle: We re in Sheriff. Dave Wedding: Oh, Sheriff, okay, I m sorry, I thought you was talking about everything. President Montrastelle: Yeah, we re in Sheriff. Dave Wedding: Yeah, in the Sheriff, you re talking about 1050? Councilmember Terry: Yes. Dave Wedding: Okay. President Montrastelle: Yes. Dave Wedding: We asked for an additional $6,000 to fund the Canine account. We ve been working on $9,000 annually for years and years. One fully trained police canine, costs us between $15,000-$16,000. We have six canines working. They re like humans, they have problems, diseases, fractured canines, veterinarian bills, food costs, training costs. So, the money that we asked for still won t pay the entire Canine budget, but we ll make it up, but the $9,000 is pretty inadequate to fund six dogs. President Montrastelle: So, you went over nine, you re going over $9,000 this year? Dave Wedding: We go over that well, I mean, it s like James and the great people at the Nut Club, they ve gave us donations. We ve relied upon citizens donations to fund our Canine account President Montrastelle: That s how you ve made up the difference? Dave Wedding: -- for the last five years.

15 BUDGET HEARING Page 15 of 40 President Montrastelle: You ve made up the difference that way? Dave Wedding: Yeah. President Montrastelle: Yeah. Dave Wedding: We ve receive very generous donations to help us President Montrastelle: Keep it up, James. Councilmember Raben: Sheriff, some of oh, go ahead, I m sorry. Oh, I was just going to say, some of the differences, like Shift Differential, Clothing Allowance, you know, a lot of that s specific to the new contract. Dave Wedding: Yeah, they re must have. Councilmember Raben: Yeah. So, the only ones that, you know, are maybe up for discussion is the Overtime is a $95,000 increase, and then one that I was going to call attention to is Garage & Motors, while that s up $20,000, there s actually $70,000 in the CCD budget. (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) Dave Wedding: Right. Councilmember Raben: (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) Dave Wedding: Yeah. The only other one, Data Management, we asked for a little increase. As everybody know, operating a large jail and Operations Center, vehicles, the money it costs for the computer upgrades, license, software, cameras in the jail, it s gone through the roof, and we ve been struggling the last couple of years trying to just keep all the cameras and equipment operating in the jail. Councilmember Raben: That s one we could consider moving to CCD, possibly, but, Sheriff, you re still really a stand alone in regards of the management part of your systems, right? Dave Wedding: Yes. That s correct. Councilmember Raben: So, we re not spending, we re not spending any money with the IT expense and cost associated with the Civic Center here. Dave Wedding: Right. Councilmember Raben: So, he s doing a whole lot with very little, in comparison. Dave Wedding: (Inaudible), right. Our Data Management is basically covering mostly with phone calls from inmates, and tablets and we instituted a new program, to receive more funding, to offset the cost of data management by selling more products to the inmates. SHERIFF/CCD President Montrastelle: Okay. We can now move to account on page 57, which is the CCD. I think you Councilmember Raben: So, at the top you ll see the $70,000 Garage & Motors that I was referring to that s also in the other budget. President Montrastelle: Big increase in Motor Vehicles here. Just additional vehicles needed? Dave Wedding: Well, that s to keep the fleet up, like tires and oil changes, transmissions, just routine maintenance. It s for breakdowns. President Montrastelle: It s not new vehicles? Dave Wedding: It s not for the purchase. Councilmember Raben: (Inaudible. Microphone not on.)

16 Page 16 of 40 Dave Wedding: Are you going to a different BUDGET HEARING President Montrastelle: I m looing at Motor Vehicles, Capital Outlay. Councilmember Raben: (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) Dave Wedding: Oh, you re out of Garage & Motor, you re in Motor Vehicles? I m sorry, I m sorry. Councilmember Raben: That number, I can answer that for you while you look. That number has existed for, since Main Street was an alley, basically. That s kind of a number that used to be a target of like ten vehicles. Dave Wedding: Right. Councilmember Raben: At a cost of 25 grand. I don t think that gets you ten vehicles today. Dave Wedding: No. Councilmember Raben: But, that number, that s where that originated. President Montrastelle: The 250 did? Councilmember Raben: Yeah. Dave Wedding: Uh-huh. Councilmember Raben: Yeah, but, you know, some years, if you look in 2016, we didn t allow for any vehicles. So, sometimes you re playing catch up. So, those 2016 year old vehicles next year are probably three, well 2015 vehicles, because we didn t buy any in 16. Dave Wedding: Right. Councilmember Raben: So, we ve got four, five year old vehicles out there that Dave Wedding: And older. Councilmember Raben: --yeah, that probably need to be replaced, so. President Montrastelle: Okay. Councilmember Raben: But, that s one for negotiation for sure. President Montrastelle: Yeah. Councilmember Raben: If that s what you re thinking. President Montrastelle: Yeah. Councilmember Raben: Okay. SHERIFF/COIT President Montrastelle: Okay, next is account , which is the COIT, on page 103. It s flat. What do you cover under Contractual Services there? Dave Wedding: Are you talking about like the President Montrastelle: I mean, you re requesting 130K for under Contractual Services. Dave Wedding: Okay, that s for our information technology provider, Greg Selby. President Montrastelle: Okay. Councilmember Raben: leases And probably others. You ve probably got copy machine Dave Wedding: Right.

17 BUDGET HEARING Page 17 of 40 Councilmember Raben: -- or something else that gets bundled in there. Dave Wedding: Any of the equipment we buy, computers, software license. Councilmember Raben: Now, the Rent, that s for the new Command Center, right? Dave Wedding: Operations Center. Councilmember Raben: I mean, Operations Center. President Montrastelle: Yeah, and how many years is that, Sheriff? Was it ten or 15? Dave Wedding: I thought it was at least 15 years. President Montrastelle: Yeah. Okay, any questions on that part? JAIL President Montrastelle: Then we ll move to Jail, on page, account number 1320, on page 29. Councilmember Goebel: Sheriff, you have, today you came before us for an additional $500,000 for Out of County, and next year you ve asked for a 347 percent increase. It s line , Other Services. Dave Wedding: Are you talking for the housing of inmates out of county? Councilmember Goebel: Well, I guess, that s what it is, but this year s, with what you asked for today, it s like $1.3 million. Dave Wedding: Right. Councilmember Goebel: And you re requesting 2.3? Dave Wedding: Yeah, our numbers to house out, we ve been holding them as long as we can in the jail, and we re forced to send more out. So, it s an increase, plus now, on the good side, is we will be reimbursed about $1.6 million from the DOC, which is kind of going to offset that number of 2.3 that we re requesting from you, because it s reimbursed. So, the largest percentage of it, or about 125 of the 175 inmates would be reimbursed. President Montrastelle: Okay. Councilmember Raben: (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) Dave Wedding: Say that again? Councilmember Raben: The large, the (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) Regan Buchanan: It s QCC. Dave Wedding: Okay, it will be our medical provider. Councilmember Raben: Okay. Councilmember Terry: Does this include, I guess, additional staff, right, that you need? Dave Wedding: What s that? Councilmember Terry: Does this budget, I guess, include any additional Dave Wedding: Yeah, we haven t included the additional staff in this. Councilmember Raben: You do have, the 12 that you moved over, they re in here, aren t they? Councilmember Goebel: Yeah. Dave Wedding: Yeah Councilmember Raben: The 12

18 Page 18 of 40 Dave Wedding: They re not additional staff. BUDGET HEARING Councilmember Raben: Yeah, I know, but they re in Dave Wedding: Yes. Councilmember Raben: --they re now Dave Wedding: Right. Councilmember Raben: --part of these numbers here. Dave Wedding: Right. They was existing staff, just doing less assignments. Councilmember Raben: Yeah. Okay. Councilmember Kiefer: I ve got a question. So, the total budget for the Confinement Officers and Personnel Services is right at $6.1 million? Councilmember Raben: Yeah, 6.1. Councilmember Kiefer: Okay, because I was trying to, you know, look at these, this thing Commissioner Musgrave gave us, and find where that six million dollars was at in her line item, and, under expenditures it says current, she s got current jail personnel expenditures are like around $1.4 million. So, I mean Councilmember Raben: Wait a minute, I think it s Councilmember Shetler: (Inaudible. Microphone not on.) Councilmember Kiefer: Well, it says current jail personnel Councilmember Shetler: Right. Councilmember Kiefer: --expenditures, and none of those numbers come close to six million dollars. Councilmember Raben: I think there is a column that does though. Councilmember Kiefer: See what I m saying? Councilmember Terry: Either way, I think you said you wanted to kind of look at that. So, I don t know that we need to Councilmember Raben: Yeah, we don t need to Councilmember Terry: --spend time comparing right at this point. Councilmember Kiefer: Right, no, no, no, I m just, it just caught my attention, because I saw this, and then I saw this, and I was like, wow, those numbers are way off. Councilmember Raben: I think that annual is no, yeah, that s, yeah, that s just part of the entire confusion about Councilmember Kiefer: Right. Councilmember Raben: --let s give us more time to work through the numbers. Okay. President Montrastelle: Okay, anything else about the Jail, on page 29? Any questions, anything else you want to point out, Sheriff, on account 1320? Dave Wedding: No. President Montrastelle: I think you ve did you touch on Dave Wedding: Obviously, the jail, because it s an ever changing dynamic, and with the increase in inmates, your costs are going to go up some. It s hard to predict, or having certain people in there, they re destructive, it can raise your costs. So, it s a very volatile number that we can t really predict.

19 BUDGET HEARING Page 19 of 40 President Montrastelle: You ve got a big increase on your Supplies, which is Councilmember Raben: He zeroed out the line above it. He s combining the two. President Montrastelle: Oh, is that what that is? Councilmember Raben: Yeah. President Montrastelle: Aww, okay, got it. LIT PUBLIC SAFETY President Montrastelle: Okay, account number 1170, on page 71, Local Income Tax Public Safety. Councilmember Raben: That s the LIT. There s no requests, yeah. Now, this is one we might need to look at the Out of County Housing for the next few years. Shifting this into the LIT account, some of the other big number items, but we ll discuss that throughout this process. JAIL/COIT President Montrastelle: Okay, account number , on page 108, which is the Jail/COIT. Medical has gone up, or is going up, based on your estimate percent. You re holding your Food flat. I guess that s a contract, a multi-year contract? Dave Wedding: Uh-huh. Councilmember Raben: He s, I mean, he deserves some credit on what he s done in regards to Food. This number today is probably less than it was Dave Wedding: Yeah, we ve brought our food prices Councilmember Raben: --six years ago. Dave Wedding: --per meal down about 31 cents per meal. So, that s hundreds of thousands of dollars of savings, just feeding the inmates, so. President Montrastelle: Right. Dave Wedding: We work very well with the provider. President Montrastelle: That was the year before last. Dave Wedding: Yeah, several years ago we did that. Councilmember Raben: See in 2016 we probably had a hundred fewer people Dave Wedding: Right. Councilmember Raben: --and we were spending more money than this. Dave Wedding: Right. President Montrastelle: On your Medical, your increase, is that because the, who you re contracted with, they re rates going up? Dave Wedding: No, it s mostly because of the increase in inmates. When we signed with them we had a number of inmates, and over the course of time that s gone up substantially, between 50 and 100 inmates. President Montrastelle: Is it a contract though? Dave Wedding: Yes. President Montrastelle: So, when it Dave Wedding: But, it was a contract based on how many inmates we have in custody.